Posted by: masterwarlord | March 6, 2012

MW Top 26s – Tackiest Sets (26-14)

Tacky is a term that has evolved in its’ use in MYM to the point that it is a very broad word that doesn’t quite mean what it originally did, though it hasn’t become an MYM exclusive word like flow. Generally, tacky refers to forced creativity (A term that died out in favor of tacky), particularly when this flashy stuff has no relevance to the playstyle. The most immediate signs of tackiness are when these sorts of moves occupy very simplistic inputs like standards and aerials – couldn’t you find SOMEWHERE to place in that summon aside from the dtilt? Moves that have effects that don’t match the animations/lack of animations is a more modern cause of tackiness.

Characterization also comes into the mix on a regular basis – Pussycat Puss or AI Colonel, as examples, would make it if not for the hippoish nature of characters they are, while random creative things that go against a character’s personality become much more glaring. For the same reason, jokesets and sets that are intentionally distorting a character to be unrecognizable, such as Sundance’s MYM 5 Sakurai, are exempt. The most obvious example of characterization based tackiness that comes up regularly, at least in older sets, is massive quantities of random props that don’t do all that much for the character, making the movesets more representative of the game then the character. It works for some sets for characters with minimal character, but it’s another thing for personified ones.

Due to sheer quantity of participants for this list, it is broken up into two parts – two top 13s adding up to a top 26. This week, we’ll look at 26-14. . .

26 – Mario Remix by SkylerOcon – MYM 6

Mario Remix’s jab and dtilt are the stuff of legends. The dtilt has Ocon –admit- that it’s for an obscure terrible game as Mario breakdances DDR style, while the jab. . .Well, the entirety of MYM hated it, and I warned him many, many times  to take it out while previewing it. What is it, you ask? Mario takes out a Yoshi Kid and has them attempt to devour the foe before putting them away. There’s also of course the Kuribo Shoe for the dsmash which is just about as fitting here as it’d be in n88’s Goomba set. For other attempts to get creativity into his set, Ocon resorts to luck based moves that have a –chance- of something happening, such as the fsmash. This wouldn’t be all so odd if it wasn’t for the rest of the set being about as intentionally bland as you can get for a combo based playstyle, making these other moves stick out like sore thumbs. Ocon insists on keeping in as much as possible to make Mario play like his Brawl self (Despite having glaring tacky moves), having an insistence on giving a huge focus to FLUDD over other Mario’s other games. This makes the set come across as more of Ocon’s Mario than a definitive Mario remix in a very awkward and tacky fashion.

25 – Paper Mario by SkylerOcon and Wizzerd – MYM 6

This set has Ocon and Wizzerd working together – this means that Ocon is not the one that has to do pandering with creativity, as he showed how terrible he is at that with Mario Remix and Metagross. Letting Wizzerd handle the tacky stuff isn’t the best of ideas, though, less you end up with that horrid dsmash that generates a gigantic menu to equip badges from. A handful of which are entirely aesthetic and have no purpose. There’s also the mechanic of gaining star power through “appeals” which is tacked onto every move, and then the only way to actually use it is contained within the Final Smash where Wizzerd is imprisoned by Ocon, and all the various star attacks go entirely unnoticed.

Now, believe it or not, Ocon contributes to this set’s tackiness more than Wizzerd none the less. The set’s playstyle, of all the possible things, is to stall out the foe. Nevermind how the set isn’t particularly defensive, the emphasis is on moves that let Mario run away above all else. Many sets in MYM are entirely responsive, but their endgoal is never to stall out the foe. If it’s ever involved, it’s more of a threat to get the character’s actual playstyle to advance further. Here, the entire point of the moveset is just to run away.

24 – Envy by MasterWarlord – MYM 6

This moveset has more of those random pictures found in other sets in this list, and while it’s not as great of a degree it’s for a very awkward character who’s potential is too difficult to really pull off in a single moveset. This results in a bunch of moves where Envy gains various transformations – some making sense like bulking up, while others just being random or simply awkward for a single move, with crap like turning into a flea or his bloody dragon form from that terrible movie for an fair. Said dragon move in combination with generating items (Albeit limited if items are turned off) comes across incredibly awkward. While the individual examples aren’t as glorious as some other movesets ignoring this, the somewhat awkward animations combined with the somewhat awkward gameplay effects of the moves leave a very Davish taste in one’s mouth.

23 – Azumarill by MarthTrinity – MYM 5

This is essentially the posterboy set for Pokemon syndrome, as I believe that this was the set that got people to actually start using the term (Though I doubt we could figure out the source even if we tried). Still, aside from quantity of awkward moves, MT takes the effects of the moves directly from the game most of the time, showcasing why people used it as a source of creativity to start with. This moveset also started one of two (Jafar’s DARK headers) tacky clichés with headers that were later loathed and disposed of  in putting sprites next to every single header. To start off, Azumarill has a pair of ice moves. Sure, every fully evolved water type not named Seismitoad has Ice Beam, but the main reason Ice Beam gets used is simply for the obvious interactions with water, and then the ice is done with. Here, the ice serves no particular purpose.

These moves are just the tip of the iceberg, though, as we get into lots of generic physical TMs like Swagger, Double-Edge, Iron Tail, Frustration, and Giga Impact. Ignoring move names, does Azumarill’s tail look all that durable to you, or does he look all that hateful? The only argument for Giga Impact and Double-Edge that can be brought up is Azumarill’s competitive ability that doubles his attack stat, but that makes just about as much sense as Salamence dancing about like a hippo to boost his stats. Swagger has a plethora of random effects that is intentionally left open to interpretation in the writing. Lastly, Azumarill even can summon rain on command, but doesn’t take advantage of all the tacky moves in any way to make something worthwhile.

22 – Jason Voorhees by Katapultar – MYM 8

Yes, yes, there is that god-awful clapping utilt everybody remembers that caused us to burst into laughter and fall out of our chairs that should easily make top 26 tackiest moves. There’s more to the set than that, though, with Jason having a Game & Watch bucket style move with no animation that Katapultar implies has Jason store projectiles inside of his body, a very tacky counter based Reincarnation that is supposed to represent Jason coming back again and again instead of simply making Jason at all durable, and the one thing everybody remembers Jason for, the machete.

Jason wants the foe to take his machete to give them a terrible moveset that he is “designed” to counter, when anybody outside of Ganondorf counters it due to it being so terrible. Jason has next to no way of directly forcing the foe to take the machete, though, meaning they have no reason to take it and making the entire set fall to pieces outside of the generic suicide KO + reincarnation combination that fills up almost all the aerials, complete with the dragging down uair we all love so much. If Jason somehow hits with the laggy throwing of his Machete, he will impale them with it and the foe will take it out of their body before automatically using it – because it’s so in-character for characters to be forced to use a terrible weapon, much less a horror movie villian’s weapon. Last but not least, it’s very difficult to manage something like this, and whether or not it’s fitting is rather out of the question on a list like this – Jason manages to have a tacky –organization- of all things.

21 – Mr. Dream by KoppaKirby – MYM 7

KK thought he’d cash in on the “success” of the Punch Out movement by making a crown jewel for it in Mr. Dream. Many sets try to represent their games as a whole by taking out various items from it, but Mr. Dream’s different. . .He steals the attacks of all the other various Punch Out boxers, even having Macho Man’s release the bogus. Not only this, but the moveset is very self aware and is calling attention to it, stating that Mr. Dream uses the “signature move” of “yet ANOTHER” boxer. The fun doesn’t stop there, as Mr. Dream has a –trophy- as a prop, has the ability to teleport (Which he uses multiple times despite it serving no gameplay function), and can even heal the foe with one of his throws.

20 – Bowser Remake by dancingfrogman – MYM 5

Movesets in MYM 4 and 5 had a terrible tendency to post pictures alongside each move to show what they were basing a move off of, regardless of how useful it actually was, just to have something to base a move off of for each input. It’s rather awkwardly showcased in this Bowser moveset with various summons making up a portion of the moveset on random inputs, most glaringly the ftilt Bullet Bill launcher and dsmash Warp Pipes. More glaringly, though, is DFM making extensive use of Super Mario RPG, most obviously by giving Bowser his various magic there with Smady style poison clouds and making the foe flee in terror uncontrollably, but also with random props like a mud suit nair, throwing chain chomp fsmash, and the ability to shoot spikes from his shell via bair. Bowser in particular feels awkward as such a trappy character, making him out to be more of a constructer than a destroyer.

19 – Thief Khee’bler by Agidius – MYM 6

When the set first came out, even back then people were saying “Too much law, not enough ninja”. The grab-game is essentially an awkward way to manipulate a mechanic, putting the units on it up and down until you get just the right amount and altering terms of the deal with no actual throwing involved. Most of the set itself, on the other hand, is stuff like throwing pieces of paper at the foe to alter contracts, mostly in superfluous ways to just make more moves that interact with the mechanic. The purpose of getting the foe to sign a contract to break involves giving Thief access to his smashes. . .one of which is his only KO move, two of which are –more- pointless mechanic manipulators which are useless when you’re already done with said mechanic to advance this far into the playstyle. What is most infamous about the set, though, particularly in the set’s original time, is the Thief summoning two of his allies as aerials of all things. They’re so powerful and so blatantly steal the show that you can only use these allies once per stock – there’s a reason one time use moves never caught on. . .In addition to summoning his allies, Thief breaks the fourth wall by summoning Sakurai himself. Not as a one time use, mind you, but as a central element in the bloody moveset.

18 – Bowser Jr./Shadow Mario by BKupa666 – MYM 5

Yes, this moveset managed to make it on over Wart’s dtilt or Kaptain K. Ombo, largely due to sheer quantity of tacky moves. The moveset largely manages this by being 2 movesets in one,  showing that Kupa ran out of steam later on in this set. There’s plenty of traps/minions/etc summoned by standard inputs, as had become common practice in MYM 5. If this set was going to play the MYM 5 trap character totally straight, it probably wouldn’t have made the list. However; this set has things like spikes being shot out of Jr.’s paintbrush and Shadow Mario having eye lasers. The paintbrush can even summon Poison Ivy style thorns from the ground, and Shadow Mario can generate duplicates that when killed turn into. . .Boos? Random effects are in abundance here, and on the most random of inputs – fair has Jr. take out a Mario Kart ? block that generates a random Mario Kart item, and –BTHROW- of all things generates a random minion from a long list.

17 – Robo-Link MKIII by Tirkaro – MYM 10

Robo Link is pretty definitive of tackiness – the term could just as well be named after Tirk as David and it probably would be if Tirk was even half as loud as David is. Every move is ridiculously long with lots of very awkward effects to the point that the writing style points out whenever the moveset has a generic attack, in sheer shock, completely and utterly self aware. The specials in particular have long lists of potential effects to choose from, much like the fair and bthrow from Bowser Jr. This moveset amplifies the tackiness from the previous two Robo Links in Tirk’s desperate attempt to get noticed and mock MYM. . .So why isn’t it higher? Quite simply because it so blatantly borders on a jokeset it’s not funny, and because of the OC status of the character giving Tirk largely unlimited leeway that even Pussycat Puss and AI Colonel mentioned in the opening would love to have. Either way, you have to be –especially- offensive to beat this moveset, and we’ve got 3 more sets on this half of the list and then an entire top 13 left to go.

16 – Father Time by KingK.Rool – MYM 5

Flat Top’s in Pussycat’s boat, so he’s pretty much immune to this list. Father Time, on the other hand, is a largely overlooked Rool set that has almost every single attack manipulate the mechanic in a different superfluous way in a manner not unlike Thief Khee’bler, with the differences in the effects being so unjustified by the animation that it’s hard to figure out just what’s going on – Rool admits to losing track of this moveset himself even back when he made it. Moves that do not fall under this fall under the category of creative animations/effects for the sake of them, with Father Time specifically stopping stage hazards with his nair and stealing the foe’s youth for god knows what purpose with his bair.

15 – Inspector Lunge by MasterWarlord – MYM 7

Now, this set doesn’t have an abundance of tacky inputs, being a similar case to Mario Remix in that regard. However, what –is- there is far, far tackier. Firstly, there’s the mechanic that requires the foe to be a murderer – if ever there was a set that potentially mischaracterized foes, this is probably it – then if they don’t kill them, they inexplicably die right then and there. The other tacky part of the set is Lunge being able to copy essentially any move – regardless of the move not having the animation of the copied move and only the gameplay effect, it still results in very tacky moves, such as melee attacks with invisible hitboxes. What’s worse is that Lunge can actually be played as a far more competent TAC to boot, with help from stuff like his tacky dtilt. . .He’s using a magnifying glass, so clearly this means it must put the foe in the Smash Bros magnifying glass! Indeed, don’t run past that man inspecting the ground with his magnifying glass, or else you’ll go off an invisible blast zone.

14 – Fawful by Nicholas1024 – MYM 9

And here comes the “winner” of part 1 – with all these candidates, aren’t you glad that we covered the sets that missed out on the top 13? The first point is that Fawful can summon giant robots, and then has 4 moves that have him do nothing but take out a control stick and manipulate the alarm. The robot isn’t exactly central to the set, and it does absolutely nothing unless ordered to via these 4 moves – these 4 moves which very awkwardly occupy the usmash and the 3 tilts. Now, the –actual- centerpiece of the set involves stalling for a Dark Fawful transformation via dsmash, which has Fawful summon the Dark Star, and then either absorb it or make a shadow clone of the foe with the fthrow.  The problem is the Dark Fawful transformation is very powerful and the time to summon the Dark Star is very long. While it’s number crunching, there are so many other strategies here that it legitimately looks like it’s just another option to go on. That and the fact that the Dark Star isn’t a Special. When you have an elaborate mechanic to fatten the foe up with serving them fatty food and a stall then fall dair that gives light little Fawful superarmor (Which I personally loathe more than the Grinch’s), you’ve got quite the tacky combination.



  1. I caught so much flack about not liking Paper Mario and not really being able to describe why. I think it’s one of the best examples of me disliking a set before we had all come up with the right words and concepts to explain it.

    I’d say Robo-Link is too deliberate and self-aware to qualify for a list like this. tirk sets play by different rules and you could fill a list with them but not really have gotten at anything too interesting.

    Mr Dream is still a mystery. I think it’s supposed to be satirical or humorous but just didn’t quite make it there and wound up floundering somewhere halfway.

    I’m partly responsible for Fawful. This is why I don’t proofread, folks – I’m just going to spot a bunch of cool effects that deserve more of a spotlight and dream up some playstyle that wasn’t there to begin with and when you try to combine all of my suggestions into one package you’re going to wind up with a million different strategies. And I hippoed massively in accidentally telling him to put the Dark Star in DSmash, when what I really meant to say was DSpec.

    Father Time, tacky? Okay, stealing the foe’s youth is pretty bad, but you could pretty much pull random effects like that out of any MYM5 (or earlier) moveset. His forced creativity is all too intertwined and playstyle-slanted for him to qualify, if you ask me… but hey, it’s your list (and I actually like this one – looking forward to the second half).

  2. There really are no “good” words to use to describe how much utter contempt and loathing you hold for something. It’s never a good thing, really, so there aren’t any “good” words for it.

    I’ll say this about Thief: it wasn’t a set for the Final Fantasy Thief. It was a set for 8-bit Theater’s Thief, who very much IS a hellspawned lawyer, like DM, more than he is a ninja, at least from a characterization standpoint. Does that excuse the set’s other drawbacks?, not really, but it takes away a lot of the tackiness when you realize that that really IS how Thief fights in the comic. It’s what his character is basically centered around.

    And…I could see Azumarill using Iron Tail (WARY). Iron Tail’s whole gig is that it hardens the tail. Do that to Azumarill and you have a mace with a saw for a handle.

  3. Robo-Link’s the only one I disagree with, as it felt like a parody of tackiness rather than a set that was trying to be serious but ended up up tacky. Otherwise, hilarious

  4. You ever gonna pop in the chat again, PC, seeing as you’re never leaving? (tipsy)

    It’ll be awesome even if you just got in the phatchat. Also Tirk misses you for some Pathfinder-related reason.

  5. Well I don’t really have any reason NOT to go in the chat anymore since I’ve been packed and ready to leave for two weeks now. I didn’t think anyone really cared much, though. But why the dicks not, I miss you lot already.

  6. Now to wade through 15 Xat bookmarks since I don’t label them and forgot the specific numbers. Silver you’re an ass.

  7. I expect the top 13 to be dominated by Dave sets.

  8. While I suspect that there will be Dave sets on the Top 13, this imposter is lying scum.

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